Giving up with pressure barrels

[Sandimas]

I'm at the end of my tether with pressure barrels and brews going off. Been brewing 8 years and using a mixture of bottles and pressure barrels since the start, they were initially fine but in the past 3 years I've been having issues with beers in the barrel going off. It's not the beer - I often bottle half the batch and keg the rest.

So, latest brew was half-bottled and half-kegged mid December. Keg was initially fine, I've been trying a half every weekend, just tried one (19th Jan) it's starting to go just like the others: TCP taste and smell developing. The bottled brew is fine.

Prior to kegging this one, I treated the keg to a really good clean and dose of diluted bleach. Rinsed very well. Purged with 3 blasts of CO2 then releasing the lid a little to let out the oxygen after the CO2 has settled.

Any thought on what is going wrong before I take 3 kegs down the tip?

 

[Ajhutch]

I have been having a similar experience to you so will watch with interest for the responses!

 

[Clint]

I have two pb...one seems to be fine ..the other is rubbish no matter what I do to it. Bottling needs too much time...

 

[MmmBeer]

The TCP off flavour is chlorophenol, caused by the presence of chlorine, either in your water, or possibly from the bleach you used to clean your PB with.

Before ditching your barrels, give one a really good clean with a chlorine free cleaner and rinse well, to see if this prevents recurrence of the problem.

I know the curse of off flavours, I had 3 or 4 brews on the trot suffering from DMS. I completely changed my techniques, getting the water treatment spot on, extending my boil to 90 mins and over-pitching yeast, which together have resolved the problem.

 

[Sadfield]

The TCP off flavour is chlorophenol, caused by the presence of chlorine, either in your water, or possibly from the bleach you used to clean your PB with.

Before ditching your barrels, give one a really good clean with a chlorine free cleaner and rinse well, to see if this prevents recurrence of the problem.

I know the curse of off flavours, I had 3 or 4 brews on the trot suffering from DMS. I completely changed my techniques, getting the water treatment spot on, extending my boil to 90 mins and over-pitching yeast, which together have resolved the problem.

I doubt that TCP like flavours will develop in pressure barrels from chlorine contamination, they will be present from primary fermentation. Wild yeast/bacterial contamination will however create medicinal flavours over time as 4-Vinyl Guaiacol (4VG) levels increase.

 

[Sandimas]

I doubt that TCP like flavours will develop in pressure barrels from chlorine contamination, they will be present from primary fermentation.

I've had this problem for a few years, hence bottling some from every batch. The bottled beers are fine every time, sometimes 6-9 months later, so I don't think it's an infection - I've had infections in the past resulting in bottle bombs.

 

[Sadfield]

I've had this problem for a few years, hence bottling some from every batch. The bottled beers are fine every time, sometimes 6-9 months later, so I don't think it's an infection - I've had infections in the past resulting in bottle bombs.

If the source of the infection is in the keg, then surely the bottles would be fine. I often deliberately "infect" beers with wild yeast/bacteria and don't get bottle bombs either. I do however always get phenolic flavours (by design).

 

[MagnusTS]

You've done well going 8 years before dumping your PB.
I chucked mine after my very 1st brew.
Mind you it was part of a very cheap starter set, so maybe not the best PB.

But I think @Sadfield might be right, maybe some hard to shift wild yeast in your PB?
Could you borrow or buy a new PB to see if you still get the same problem?

 

[aamcle]

I have two 1/2 size barrels, the type with a smaller cap, I've never had any problem with them, except when I tried to tighten a leaking tap and it sheared off a jet of ale hit me in the chest.......

I've had beer in there for over 12months with out contamination, it was a boring Parti gyle and I'd forgotten it.

Oh well.

 

[Sadfield]

You've done well going 8 years before dumping your PB.
I chucked mine after my very 1st brew.
Mind you it was part of a very cheap starter set, so maybe not the best PB.

But I think @Sadfield might be right, maybe some hard to shift wild yeast in your PB?
Could you borrow or buy a new PB to see if you still get the same problem?

The more I think about it, I do wonder if, when pressurised the barrels swell and beer gets into places that detergents and sanitiser doesn't, as cleaning is done at atmospheric pressure. After all they are only plastic and will fatigue.

 

[Sandimas]

Could you borrow or buy a new PB to see if you still get the same problem?

I've done that. 2 barrels are my own: a budget one and a King Keg. I borrowed a like-new budget one off my brother-in-law to see if I can crack the problem and it's the beer in there that's currently going off. The only factor might be that he didn't have an S30 cap on his so I used mine off my old barrel - I do find these hard to clean/sanitise.

Think I'll give it one last go with a non-chlorine based sanitiser as suggested above, as I really can't think of anything else. The good thing is that it is predicable - the beer will start to go at the 3/4 week point. Previously I was drinking beer that was 4-5 months old out of these.

 

[terrym]

The more I think about it, I do wonder if, when pressurised the barrels swell and beer gets into places that detergents and sanitiser doesn't, as cleaning is done at atmospheric pressure. After all they are only plastic and will fatigue.

That is a very good point
I have two standard PBs which do balloon out when they are fully pressurised, and that's with me trying to not overpressurise.
I have had two PBs fail, within 2 years or less of use. The first developed a pinhole leak in the shell, the second had a crack in the seam. Both leaks were only evident when the PB was pressurised.
So who knows what can lurk in the tiny internal fissures that open up
That said I never have any problem with beer from PB, nor leaks from cap fittings. Were it not for the fact that they seem to prone to developing shell failures (as evidenced by the one with the seam problem) I would invest in more, since they are convenient and you waste less beer compared to bottles. Relatively mine didn't cost all that much (Tesco Direct sales, remember them?) and the prospect of spending upwards of £40 on something that could fail within 18 months after limited use means that when my two eventually give up the ghost I'll probably not replace them.

 

[BeerCat]

I have abandoned mine. Either leaked or the beer went off. Couldn't win.

 

[man_beach]

Still using a 5 gall Hambleton Bard pressure barrel which I purchased in 1998. I alternate it with a King Keg. After use I clean internally with normal washing up liquid then use Young's Steriliser & Cleaner - 2 tablespoons, fill to the brim with warm water & leave about 1/2 hour. Never had any problems with off flavours - and I've had some beers in the barrel for a couple of months