Flavour of Cara Red?

[NottsBrew]

Hi People.

I recently made a red beer. I thought I'd borrow the malt profile from another recipe but give it a personal hop twist. I used Nelson Sauvin, because it's a real favourite of mine, and Huell Melon for flavour/aroma. For the bittering hop, I used Pacific Gem. I have never used Pacific Gem before. I think I used 50g of Pacific Gem. I chose Pacific Gem because I read it had a berry flavour and I liked the idea of a red ale having that berry flavour. Just jump in, I thought.

I collected 3.5 gallons. I used 50g of roasted barley and 500g of Cara Red. This was the first time I had used Cara Red. I just put the Cara Red in until I had the right colour. It was steeped pre boil. that amount of Cara Red did indeed give me the colour I was looking for. The roast barley went in with the mash.

Anyway... I've been drinking the finished beer recently and it certainly has a berry flavour. In the write-up about Pacific Gem, the flavour of blackberries was mentioned. In my beer though, I would say it had a flavour much closer to elderberries! In fact the similarity to eldeberries is so strong that I would believe you if you'd told me you'd snuck some in when I wasn't looking!

Now this is my question. what contribution to the flavour did the Cara Red make? Has anybody got that elderberry flavour just from Pacific Gem? I'm wondering if it might be a combination of the two.

I could keep experimenting, but I thought it would save me time if I just got you guys to comment. I think the info you could give me might help me to hone down where I need to adjust the recipe. I'm actually very happy with the flavour including the elderberry, but I just want to tone it down a little so it's not so dominant.

Thank you in advance guys.

 

[JonBrew]

sounds like a good brew. i have never used cara red but have recently used made a ESB with loads of pacific gem added late in the boil. in my brew i used challenger as the bittering hop. the finished beer has a distinct blackberry flavor and aroma.

i know this has been the subject of some debate but i have always understood that hoops used to bitter contribute little in the way of flavor - rather different varieties of bitterness if that makes sense, i.e. harsh, smooth and so forth.

you mentioned you used nelson sauvin as on of your aroma hops and, although i have never used that hop myself, i know it is said to have a distinctive fruity/white wine aroma. i would hazard a guess that the elderberry you are perceiving could be a combination of malty/toffee sweetness from the cara red and the fruity notes from the nelson sauvin and hull melon.

could be wrong though; i often am!

 

[NottsBrew]

sounds like a good brew. i have never used cara red but have recently used made a ESB with loads of pacific gem added late in the boil. in my brew i used challenger as the bittering hop. the finished beer has a distinct blackberry flavor and aroma.

i know this has been the subject of some debate but i have always understood that hoops used to bitter contribute little in the way of flavor - rather different varieties of bitterness if that makes sense, i.e. harsh, smooth and so forth.

you mentioned you used nelson sauvin as on of your aroma hops and, although i have never used that hop myself, i know it is said to have a distinctive fruity/white wine aroma. i would hazard a guess that the elderberry you are perceiving could be a combination of malty/toffee sweetness from the cara red and the fruity notes from the nelson sauvin and hull melon.

could be wrong though; i often am!

I ought to say, Jon, that I did save a little Pacific Gem to go in late in the boil. I think that a very small amount went in dry hopping too, but the NS and HM were definitely the dominant late hops

 

[DoctorMick]

@Wilfy has used carared. I was going to use it but lost the bag I bought!

 

[hoptoit]

I have used carared and Nelson in a red ipa I'm waiting to condition. I used 600g. From what I had read it adds a sweetness of caramel /toffee flavours.
I also used Nelson, Motueka and amarillo at 15 mins, 0 mins and a 4 day dry hop.

 

[NottsBrew]

I'll be very interested to hear what happens there hoptoit. I'm certain that whatever has given my brew the elderberry flavour has something to do with the Pacific Gem. it might be it interacting with another ingredient or it might simply be a natural variety in the hop. Genetic diversity or something in the soil?

 

[Wilfy]

I used carared to do a red IPA. Gave an amazing colour about the same colour as Cameron's strongarm. Will use again.

 

[Lesinge]

I used Carared in my Flyers IPA and the taste is lovely and sweet with some caramel ...unless the Flyer hops are doing that! I love this tatse so am going to try it with another hop that I already know like Cascade to see if it is the Carared that is giving me that flavour.