First try with StarSan ...

[JimmyPage]

Hi All,

been brewing for a few years, but only discovered these forums recently - great resource.

Because I like bottled beer, preparing bottles has always been a chore. Last year, by chance, I got a mail from Amazon recommending a bottle tree, and bottle pump for use with no-rinse sanitisers. Intrigued, a little googling (I may even have read some threads here, I can't recall) bought up Videne. So excitedly I got my local pharmacy to order some, and away I went.

WHAT A DISASTER. All the beer tasted of was TCP. Wasted a whole brew.

More careful reading here, suggest I may have had the wrong kind of Videne ?

Anyway, I'm finally ready to try again. I have a brew on that'll need bottling at the weekend. I ordered some StarSan (Five Star chemicals inc.) which was delivered today. Reading the excellent guide in this forum suggests 1.5ml for a litre (I bought some mineral water with a pH of 7.0).

Is it really as easy as that ? Bottles are always washed in dishwasher, and come out sparkling, so a quick pump of StarSan, and that's it ?

I'll let you know how it goes, and may be back with some wine questions :)

 

[Moley]

Welcome to the forum :

Which Videne did you buy? It should be the antiseptic solution. Also, what dilution rate did you use? It should be the same as Star San, around 1.25 to 1.5ml to the litre of water.

I haven't yet tried Star San but have had no tainting issues with Videne.

 

[Buster]

I use Star San and also Iodophor as no rinse steralisers, I use both with Tesco Ashbeck Water which has a much lower ph than 7. I would suggest you need a much lower ph water for Star San to be effective, maybe Reverse Osmosis water from a Tropical fishery shop. I think I read somewhere that Star San needs a ph of 3 to be affective as a no rinse.

 

[joe1002]

Welcome to the forum :

I also have had no issue with Videne. I'll be interested to hear which one you used.

 

[craigite]

I use both videne and starsan. Both with standard tap water.
I seem to prefer starsan for bottles.
As soon as a bottle is emptied it is rinsed out and put into dishwasher.
They then sit on a shelf until needed, any time between an hour to a couple of months.
When I'm ready to bottle i fill a basin with water/starsan at 0.6ml/500ml (the ratio i use for my 1/2litre sprayer), rate is on the starsan bottle in US units.
I prefer the basin as I can submerge the bottle, half fill, shake and then set on the bottle rack to drip.
OK, that might be wasteful and less could be used but I just use the basin of solution to rinse the fermenter and other equipment after washing and fil the sprayer.
I also rinse the crown tops in the solution.
If i remember right the contact time is 10sec.
The quote seems to be "embrace the foam", that i supposed to mean no rinse.

So far I have 100% success and would have no hesitation in recommending the above. :thumb:

 

[Buster]

I use both videne and starsan. Both with standard tap water.
I seem to prefer starsan for bottles.
As soon as a bottle is emptied it is rinsed out and put into dishwasher.
They then sit on a shelf until needed, any time between an hour to a couple of months.
When I'm ready to bottle i fill a basin with water/starsan at 0.6ml/500ml (the ratio i use for my 1/2litre sprayer), rate is on the starsan bottle in US units.
I prefer the basin as I can submerge the bottle, half fill, shake and then set on the bottle rack to drip.
OK, that might be wasteful and less could be used but I just use the basin of solution to rinse the fermenter and other equipment after washing and fil the sprayer.
I also rinse the crown tops in the solution.
If i remember right the contact time is 10sec.
The quote seems to be "embrace the foam", that i supposed to mean no rinse.

So far I have 100% success and would have no hesitation in recommending the above. :thumb:

Could I ask you if your mix of Star San is cloudy or clear ??

 

[craigite]

I use both videne and starsan. Both with standard tap water.
I seem to prefer starsan for bottles.
As soon as a bottle is emptied it is rinsed out and put into dishwasher.
They then sit on a shelf until needed, any time between an hour to a couple of months.
When I'm ready to bottle i fill a basin with water/starsan at 0.6ml/500ml (the ratio i use for my 1/2litre sprayer), rate is on the starsan bottle in US units.
I prefer the basin as I can submerge the bottle, half fill, shake and then set on the bottle rack to drip.
OK, that might be wasteful and less could be used but I just use the basin of solution to rinse the fermenter and other equipment after washing and fil the sprayer.
I also rinse the crown tops in the solution.
If i remember right the contact time is 10sec.
The quote seems to be "embrace the foam", that i supposed to mean no rinse.

So far I have 100% success and would have no hesitation in recommending the above. :thumb:

Could I ask you if your mix of Star San is cloudy or clear ??

Somewhere in between
It is not clear like tap water but is is not a glass of milk. Say a tablespoon of milk in a gallon of water

 

[Buster]

The reason I ask is because I read that Star San if used as a non rinse sanitiser in water with a ph of higher than 3 looses is sanitising properties to practically zero the higher the ph level, correspondingly the cloudier the mix the less effective it is as a steraliser. If you do a search in google you see what I refer too.

 

[JimmyPage]

Welcome to the forum :

Which Videne did you buy? It should be the antiseptic solution. Also, what dilution rate did you use? It should be the same as Star San, around 1.25 to 1.5ml to the litre of water.

I haven't yet tried Star San but have had no tainting issues with Videne.

Thanks :)

Sadly I threw the stuff out, so I can't be sure. And like an ***** I went an bought it from a pharmacy, not online (where I'd have an order history). Having googled, I can see the bottles are almost identical

 

[rpt]

To be effective, the Starsan solution needs a pH of 3 or lower. It's not the water you mix it with that needs to be that acidic.

 

[mmaguy41]

Star san can be fine with some tap water depends on your water, it doesnt matter if it goes cloudy, it can even go cloudy in bottled water, the ph of mine is fine when mixed so i just use tap water and dont bother reusing the solution

 

[SloeBrewer]

If i remember right the contact time is 10sec.
The quote seems to be "embrace the foam", that i supposed to mean no rinse.

The instructions say two minutes, but the guy who invented it says 30 seconds is sufficient, he just has to put two mins on the label, as that is the standard for the tests in the USA.

The foam actually helps the product stick to the surfaces, so you get a longer contact time. As soon as you dilute it, or decrease the acidity, the Starsan will become ineffective. In terms of beer and wine making, any leftover Starsan in your bottles/fermenters will actually be neutralised and actually act as a (small amount) of yeast nutrient.

 

[Andyhull]

I use Videne, used it twice now and not had a problem.
I dilute it aprox 2ml to 1lt and use it as a no rinse steriliser.
have had good carbonation both times.

 

[fbsf]

I'm a bit more careful with Videne than I used to be - I have had some bottles where I've used it as a no rinse that smell of iodine when opened. So now I dunk the bottles in a bowl of videne solution for 30 secs, let them drain on the bottle tree for 10 mins, then dunk them again in clean water and drain again.

Although more work than no-rinse, it's a lot less than the triple-rinse I need to do to get rid of chlorine-based sanitiser smells.

Also, I did try to culture a yeast from a commercial bottle that failed miserably. Thinking about it, I did a no-rinse on that bottle too, so it probably was strong enough to kill the yeast in the slurry.

The one I cultured from the RCH Pitchfork, I videned then rinsed, and it went off like a train.

 

[alanywiseman.]

The instructions say two minutes, but the guy who invented it says 30 seconds is sufficient, he just has to put two mins on the label, as that is the standard for the tests in the USA.

The foam actually helps the product stick to the surfaces, so you get a longer contact time. As soon as you dilute it, or decrease the acidity, the Starsan will become ineffective. In terms of beer and wine making, any leftover Starsan in your bottles/fermenters will actually be neutralised and actually act as a (small amount) of yeast nutrient.

+1. This is bang on from my understanding. As starsan sterilises due to the low pH it should not matter if it is cloudy.

Not saying it is the best practice but as a tight git i will reuse a solutions for a few months till it starts to get a bit dirty looking (will constantly check pH mind to make sure it is 3 or less). It does start to go cloudy but I have never had a problem due to infection by doing this :thumb:

Edit: HERE is a link to another thread on star san. half way down is an interview with one of the founders which is very informative if you are unsure about the product. Word of warning though watch anything metal or varmished wood as the solution will dissovle the metal and strip the varnish but it is safe to drink :wha:

 

[JimmyPage]

Well, well, well. I ventured out to the shed to get my bottle washer, and lo! and behold, I found the old Videne bottle, which caused me such grief.

It's labelled "Videne Antiseptic Solution". So does anyone here know if it's right or wrong ?

Looking forward to first use of StarSan tomorrow ....

 

[dennisking]

I have been very impressed with starsan, does what it say's on the tin, or should I say plastic bottle.

P.S. don't suppose your Jimmy Page of Led Zeppelin fame.

 

[Asalpaws]

I know I'm starsan's biggest groupie but it awsome, I'm pretty sure I would have given up brewing by now if I had to keep rinsing bleach. The only annoying thing is having to get soft water to mix it up with as the liquid chalk in the tap here neutralizes it. T

 

[EskiBrew]

Well, well, well. I ventured out to the shed to get my bottle washer, and lo! and behold, I found the old Videne bottle, which caused me such grief.

It's labelled "Videne Antiseptic Solution". So does anyone here know if it's right or wrong ?

Looking forward to first use of StarSan tomorrow ....

That sounds right but does it say Aqua (or Aqueous) or Alcoholic Tincture on the bottle? It is the Aqueous version you need :thumb:

 

[Hainsey]

Buy de-ionised water (car battery type) for mixing with star san keeps clear for ages. Minerals in mineral water cause the star san to change ph level and go cloudy and not be an effective sanitizer.