Fermenting temprature

[frankn]

Hi, first post but I've been lurking a while.

Recently started brewing - from simple kits only so far.

Question is:-

I have no heating in fermenting room so for the four brews so far, I have used a heat belt and some bubble wrap. I have not been able to maintain a constant temp of 20 degrees, but I have managed a fairly constant 24 degrees.

I have seen elsewhere on this site that this is too high. Could you explain why or what problems I am likely to face?

Thanks.

Frank.

 

[dagovenor]

fermenting at higher temperatures can result in some undesireable tastes in your brew, its been known for your brew to taste quite sweet too!

 

[graysalchemy]

Fermenting at high temps especially in the initial phase when the yeast is multiplying can stress it and Cause it to take different metabolic pathways ending up with fusel alcohols which have a solventy taste and cause hangovers.

Best avoided IMHO.

 

[frankn]

Thank you both.

Just to follow-up, at the moment, well until today at least, outside tempreatures have meant that without heat I wouldn't reach 18 degrees. So I can't see an alternative to using the brew-belt. But even with this near the top of the fermenter, I cannot keep below 24. (Some caution needs to be exercised here because I don't know the accuracy of my stick-on thermometer).

So, "higher tempreatures are bad" but would 24 be better/worse than a) below 18 and b) fluctuating between 18 and 26?

I'm no expert but have tried the first beer (conditioning in a keg) and it tastes OK (not wonderful but OK) my only complaint (for a first attempt) is that it is completely and utterly flat.

Any other ideas for keeping FV at 20 degrees in an unheated room?

Thanks.

Frank.

 

[graysalchemy]

If you can get 18c then I would go with that. But your best bet is to make a water bath heated with a cheap aquarium heater. :thumb:

But seriously don't ferment at 24c.

 

[joe1002]

You really don't want temperature fluctuations either. When you go below 18c the fermentation will slow down or even stop, depending how far below you go. Can you wrap it in a spare quilt or something?

 

[rpt]

Some kits are happy at higher temperatures. For example, the Festival kits specify 20-25C and the Foresters Arms kits specify 28-30C. Different yeasts are happy at different temperatures.

 

[prolix]

yeasts perfer constant temps, 18 is great 24 not so bad in a darker beer (doom bar brewed at 24, I believe) not great in a pale ale.

 

[graysalchemy]

Some kits are happy at higher temperatures. For example, the Festival kits specify 20-25C and the Foresters Arms kits specify 28-30C. Different yeasts are happy at different temperatures.

:nono: :nono:

Kits often say that in order to fit in with where people are likely to brew. The only time you can get away with higher temps is if you are pitching a shed load of a yeast and you have no growth phase

If you use a packet of yeast and you ferment at 24+c you are heading for hangovers.

 

[rpt]

Some kits are happy at higher temperatures. For example, the Festival kits specify 20-25C and the Foresters Arms kits specify 28-30C. Different yeasts are happy at different temperatures.

:nono: :nono:

Kits often say that in order to fit in with where people are likely to brew. The only time you can get away with higher temps is if you are pitching a shed load of a yeast and you have no growth phase

If you use a packet of yeast and you ferment at 24+c you are heading for hangovers.

I queried this with the makers of the Foresters Arms kits and they said that in tests at 20C the beer never got below 1014 but by pitching at 30C it got down to 1008 in 3 days with no bad tastes. Perhaps this is just marketing to satisfy their impatient customers.

Is this 24C limit just received knowledge or has anyone actually done a test to confirm it's true?

 

[graysalchemy]

Some kits are happy at higher temperatures. For example, the Festival kits specify 20-25C and the Foresters Arms kits specify 28-30C. Different yeasts are happy at different temperatures.

:nono: :nono:

Kits often say that in order to fit in with where people are likely to brew. The only time you can get away with higher temps is if you are pitching a shed load of a yeast and you have no growth phase

If you use a packet of yeast and you ferment at 24+c you are heading for hangovers.

I queried this with the makers of the Foresters Arms kits and they said that in tests at 20C the beer never got below 1014 but by pitching at 30C it got down to 1008 in 3 days with no bad tastes. Perhaps this is just marketing to satisfy their impatient customers.

Is this 24C limit just received knowledge or has anyone actually done a test to confirm it's true?

Yes I have had beers which have touched higher temps during the summer and they are not the best beers I have brewed.

And what is wrong with a beer finishing at 1014? if you drop below 1010 you will end up with a dry beer lacking in body, not what I would want to be drinking.

Perhaps this is just marketing to satisfy their impatient customers.

I think you have hit the nail on the head.

Feel free to brew some beer at 28c but do a search on the net and you will find that solvent off flavours are due to high temps. I think Chris White also touches on it in his book 'Yeast'

 

[Underscore]

Any other ideas for keeping FV at 20 degrees in an unheated room?

I have a tray rather than a belt but I control it using an STC-1000. The temperature sensor is held against the outside of the FV by some foam taped to the bucket and I've got it set to turn the tray on when the brew drops to 20.5 degrees and turn it off once it hits 21 degrees. The second brew with this system is on now but the first is drinking quite nicely at the moment and got high praise from my father-in-law over Christmas...

_

 

[robsan77]

Yep, get yourself a.temp controller and hook your belt up to that.

 

[Windy]

Any other ideas for keeping FV at 20 degrees in an unheated room?

1. Remove the bubble wrap.
2. Put the bubble wrap under the heat belt instead of over it.
3. I use an imersion heater with a thermostat - cheaper than a heat belt and adjustable to the temperature you want.

 

[sc0tty81]

Any other ideas for keeping FV at 20 degrees in an unheated room?

Mines sat in a water bath (rubber garden bucket) with an aquarium heater in, set to 20c

 

[user 1684]

Some kits are happy at higher temperatures. For example, the Festival kits specify 20-25C and the Foresters Arms kits specify 28-30C. Different yeasts are happy at different temperatures.

:nono: :nono:

Kits often say that in order to fit in with where people are likely to brew. The only time you can get away with higher temps is if you are pitching a shed load of a yeast and you have no growth phase

If you use a packet of yeast and you ferment at 24+c you are heading for hangovers.

I queried this with the makers of the Foresters Arms kits and they said that in tests at 20C the beer never got below 1014 but by pitching at 30C it got down to 1008 in 3 days with no bad tastes. Perhaps this is just marketing to satisfy their impatient customers.

Is this 24C limit just received knowledge or has anyone actually done a test to confirm it's true?

Yep - I split a batch into two, half in the temperature controlled fridge at about 18 degrees C, and half in the warm, got to about 28 deg C. The fridge batch took about two weeks to ferment out fully, while the warm one went ballistic and took less than a week.

The difference was spectacular. The warm one was undrinkable p!ss, and the cooler fermented beer was really nice. I only ever ferment in the controlled fridge now.

 

[graysalchemy]

To get the esters characteristic of an english ale you will need to ferment to about 20-21c, 18c is a bit low and you may end up with a beer with less fruity flavour, but then that is dependent on the yeast. I certainly know when I have brewed at 18c with gold old notty it doesn't produces as good a flavour profile as 20-21c IMHO. :thumb:

 

[earthwormgaz]

I can personally vouch for what's being said here. I did two brews in summer which are noted for giving you a thumping hangover, whereas my winter ones have been fine!

I plan to brew shed loads in the winter when it's safe!

 

[user 1684]

To get the esters characteristic of an english ale you will need to ferment to about 20-21c, 18c is a bit low and you may end up with a beer with less fruity flavour, but then that is dependent on the yeast. I certainly know when I have brewed at 18c with gold old notty it doesn't produces as good a flavour profile as 20-21c IMHO. :thumb:

Interesting - what would you recommend for Safale S-05? The packet says 15 to 24 degrees. I usually go for 18, but I'd like a bit of fruitiness, which is lacking in my brews.

 

[graysalchemy]

To get the esters characteristic of an english ale you will need to ferment to about 20-21c, 18c is a bit low and you may end up with a beer with less fruity flavour, but then that is dependent on the yeast. I certainly know when I have brewed at 18c with gold old notty it doesn't produces as good a flavour profile as 20-21c IMHO. :thumb:

Interesting - what would you recommend for Safale S-05? The packet says 15 to 24 degrees. I usually go for 18, but I'd like a bit of fruitiness, which is lacking in my brews.

Don't use S-05 it is a clean yeast best for hoppy beers. If yo want a bit of fruit use Nottingham or S-04 or one of the Whitelab english ale yeasts.