Campaigner Indigo Rumbelow,

[Chippy_Tea]

Is this the best person they could find to represent them as Mark Austin says all the people remember is the disruption they are causing not the message they are trying to get across.

 

[Rodcx500z]

My message to her is, go and glue yourself outside of cop27 instead of the M25, she is everything that is wrong with this country an absolute moron who has no clue how her actions effect the everyday life's of hard working people, just imagin not being able to get to your fathers funeral because of her and her supportes, worst still imagin be married to her what a knobhead she is

 

[Chippy_Tea]

go and glue yourself outside of cop27 instead of the M25

He suggested that did you hear her reply

 

[Rodcx500z]

He suggested that did you hear her reply

Yes i heard him say that but not what she said i will re watch later

 

[robster62]

Do these protesters have jobs? I wonder if there bosses know why they are off work, and if they approve

 

[Rodcx500z]

Don't she look old for 28, must be all the worry and stress

 

[DuncR]

 

[An Ankoù]

She's absolutely spot on. Well done that lass! When people talk about hard working people carrying on with their daily lives. They mean "carrying on as normal". Can we continue to carry on as normal? For how long? Didn't have time to watch all the video clip, but I'll look at it later. Yeah, it's a disruption, but the Gov't won't put alternatives in place because they're well and truly sold out to the oil companies and lining their pockets accordingly. It's not our dad's and grandad's futures we should be most concerned about, rather our kid's and grandkid's. What have they got to look forward to?

Watched most of it now. Not the brightest button in the box, Mark Austin, is he? Indigo tells him why she has to resort to her methods, but he's not having it. The thing is that the seriousness of the situation justifies far more drastic action than the gentle folk of Just Stop Oil have resorted to. I think we can look forward to some real fireworks. Let's hope they're not to late.
As for Austin, he really sums up the problem. He is a big part part of the problem.

 

[Bernie]

Yeah, it's a disruption, but the Gov't won't put alternatives in place because they're well and truly sold out to the oil companies and lining their pockets accordingly. It's not our dad's and grandad's futures we should be most concerned about, rather our kid's and grandkid's. What have they got to look forward to?

We have alternatives and the choice is ours. Why do we need to look to the government? A democracy doesn't work on elections which we hope to elect our team which then dictates our lives. A democracy is freedom of choice and we should look to ourselves to take what we feel are the right actions.

 

[An Ankoù]

We have alternatives and the choice is ours. Why do we need to look to the government? A democracy doesn't work on elections which we hope to elect our team which then dictates our lives. A democracy is freedom of choice and we should look to ourselves to take what we feel are the right actions.

While I'm sympathetic to your feelings about government, I don't think what you say is what democracy is. Democracy is governance by the people as a collective and not as individuals, which seems more like anarchy. We elect our representatives, supposedly, and then it all breaks down because they then cease to represent us very much at all in many cases. Our "first past the post" system is designed to militate against democracy anyway.
Nevertheless, the crisis is too urgent to mince words so what alternatives do you propose. I'm all ears.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Watched most of it now. Not the brightest button in the box, Mark Austin, is he?

I thought his questions were spot on he asked about the tactics (edited video below) saying the message is being lost due to the tactics they are using and she waffles on about people all over the world being disrupted. and birds falling out of the sky

 

[An Ankoù]

His questions were fair enough the point is he wouldn't listen to the answers. He wasn't prepared to let her justify herself as it didn't suit his agenda. He ended up looking pretty pointless to my eyes.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

His questions were fair enough the point is he wouldn't listen to the answers. He wasn't prepared to let her justify herself as it didn't suit his agenda. He ended up looking pretty pointless to my eyes.

Taking the question in the video i just posted as an example i thought he did listen and then when she didnt answer the question about the tactics they are using asked the same question again.

 

[Chippy_Tea]

One thing i do wish he had asked about the tactics is how the protesters view the environmental damage many hundreds of vehicles standing with their engines idling causes vehicles are not designed to idle for hours on end as the article below states -


Why is idling harmful?
Vehicle emissions are the number one source of air pollution in many areas. When a car is idling, it's also polluting! Idling wastes money and natural resources. It can damage vehicles, pollute the air, and harm our health. Air pollution has been linked to asthma and other respiratory problems.

Idling causes air pollution
An idling vehicle releases harmful chemicals, gases and particle pollution ("soot") into the air, contributing to ozone, regional haze, and global climate change. Every gallon of gas burned produces more than 20 pounds of greenhouse gases.

Idling is unhealthy for you and me!
The pollution in exhaust can aggravate asthma and allergies, as well as cardiovascular and respiratory disease. Higher levels of air pollution have been linked to increased school absences, hospital visits, and even premature deaths. Vehicle emissions are still present and harmful even when you can't see the exhaust. Children are more sensitive to air pollution because they breathe 50 percent more air per pound of body weight than adults.

Idling wastes fuel and money
For each hour spent idling, a typical light duty truck burns approximately one gallon of diesel fuel, and a typical car wastes 1/5 gallon of gasoline. Idling for 10 seconds uses more fuel than turning off the engine and restarting it. Idling is like burning dollar bills!

Damages our vehicles
Idling is an ineffective way to warm up your engine, as your vehicle is made up of many moving parts. A better way to warm your vehicle's transmission, tires, suspension, steering and wheel bearings is to simply drive off slowly. Your car tends to warm up faster this way.

https://deq.nc.gov/about/divisions/...air-quality/idle-reduction/why-idling-harmful

 

[Bernie]

While I'm sympathetic to your feelings about government, I don't think what you say is what democracy is. Democracy is governance by the people as a collective and not as individuals, which seems more like anarchy. We elect our representatives, supposedly, and then it all breaks down because they then cease to represent us very much at all in many cases.

That's representative democracy but there's the original direct democracy that you see as anarchy. Maybe it is but anarchy isn't chaos. Chaos might come about if people choose to ignore laws, whatever for of government we have. Everyone claims to be the exception that challenges the law.
A few choices?
1 Choosing public transport despite the inconvenience
2 Cycling or walking despite the effort
3 turning the wick down on the heating even though there might be discomfort
4 reducing waste despite the effort
5 Home brewing to reduce packaging and transport,
This is the many ways I'm doing my bit for the planet's outermost mile and a half.

 

[Bernie]

One thing i do wish he had asked about the tactics is how the protesters view the environmental damage many hundreds of vehicles standing with their engines idling causes vehicles are not designed to idle for hours on end as the article below states -


Why is idling harmful?
Vehicle emissions are the number one source of air pollution in many areas. When a car is idling, it's also polluting! Idling wastes money and natural resources. It can damage vehicles, pollute the air, and harm our health. Air pollution has been linked to asthma and other respiratory problems.

Idling causes air pollution
An idling vehicle releases harmful chemicals, gases and particle pollution ("soot") into the air, contributing to ozone, regional haze, and global climate change. Every gallon of gas burned produces more than 20 pounds of greenhouse gases.

Idling is unhealthy for you and me!
The pollution in exhaust can aggravate asthma and allergies, as well as cardiovascular and respiratory disease. Higher levels of air pollution have been linked to increased school absences, hospital visits, and even premature deaths. Vehicle emissions are still present and harmful even when you can't see the exhaust. Children are more sensitive to air pollution because they breathe 50 percent more air per pound of body weight than adults.

Idling wastes fuel and money
For each hour spent idling, a typical light duty truck burns approximately one gallon of diesel fuel, and a typical car wastes 1/5 gallon of gasoline. Idling for 10 seconds uses more fuel than turning off the engine and restarting it. Idling is like burning dollar bills!

Damages our vehicles
Idling is an ineffective way to warm up your engine, as your vehicle is made up of many moving parts. A better way to warm your vehicle's transmission, tires, suspension, steering and wheel bearings is to simply drive off slowly. Your car tends to warm up faster this way.

https://deq.nc.gov/about/divisions/...air-quality/idle-reduction/why-idling-harmful

Have these people not heard of stop and go?

 

[Chippy_Tea]

Have these people not heard of stop and go?

I don't know i wasn't there to ask.

 

[An Ankoù]

That's representative democracy but there's the original direct democracy that you see as anarchy. Maybe it is but anarchy isn't chaos. Chaos might come about if people choose to ignore laws, whatever for of government we have. Everyone claims to be the exception that challenges the law.
A few choices?
1 Choosing public transport despite the inconvenience
2 Cycling or walking despite the effort
3 turning the wick down on the heating even though there might be discomfort
4 reducing waste despite the effort
5 Home brewing to reduce packaging and transport,
This is the many ways I'm doing my bit for the planet's outermost mile and a half.

Well let's not bandy words over what represents democracy as it gets us nowhere.
But your points: I don't know how things are in parma, but in many parts of the UK public transport is poor or non-existant, expensive and unreliable. Many motorists have little respect for cyclists and many are killed or injured or too frightened to cycle. I doubt home brewing saves anything as we cannot achieve the economies of scale or use energy as efficiently as the bigger plants.
We should all do "our bit", but it's not enough. There are too many who are too indifferent or/and too stupid to make enough of a difference. We need global changes and those are not going to happen because there are too many vested interests. So we need to make them happen or, frankly, face extinction.

 

[Clarence]

I mentioned in another thread that I had reservations as to whether beer was an "ethical" drink since it uses so much energy and water to produce. Cider and Wine seem much more climate friendly. I'll stick to the cider, though, as not a great wine drinker.

 

[Bernie]

But your points: I don't know how things are in parma, but in many parts of the UK public transport is poor or non-existant, expensive and unreliable. Many motorists have little respect for cyclists and many are killed or injured or too frightened to cycle.

My experience at work. Public transport is frequent to where I worked and not expensive; a year's season ticket to travel all round town any time on any bus was about 200 euros. I cycled, 35 miles there and back up hill and down dale. I got a thousand issues about how they were too busy, bad back, too far to catch the bus. Everyone was an exception to my point about cycling even short distances.

I doubt home brewing saves anything as we cannot achieve the economies of scale or use energy as efficiently as the bigger plants.
We should all do "our bit", but it's not enough.

If we all did it would be.

There are too many who are too indifferent or/and too stupid to make enough of a difference.

Exactly.

We need global changes and those are not going to happen because there are too many vested interests. So we need to make them happen or, frankly, face extinction.

How about a good old dictatorship?