British Bitters

[Braufather]

I know this goes right against the grain and is maybe bordering on heresy but I much prefer comercial bottled bitters compared to pub draughts. For me they are more lively and cleaner. I love Bottled shepherd neame beers as they are nice and hoppy but am also a fan of more malty bottled beers like Tim Taylor and black sheep amongst others.

I want to make an ESB but more to the commercial bottled style ( although will be racked To a keg.) than typical pub draught.

I think I read somewhere on here that some breweries actually use different yeasts for batches that will be bottled ( in fermentation not just to bottle condition) so that Could be an option, so I’m thinking of using A typical ESB malt profile but maybe a clean US yeast, carbonating well and may combine some uk hops with some new world.

Has anyone any thoughts or tips?

 

[Agentgonzo]

I remember hearing that Timothy Taylor landlord and Doom Bar (can't remember the brewery) are brewed in a different place (and thus different water) for bottling Vs cask. No idea if this is true though

 

[foxbat]

Oh boy, we do have different tastes. Well kept cask Shepherd Neame beers are, for me, in a completely different league to the bottles.

 

[Clint]

I think a proper bitters are quite difficult...its water and definitely yeast driven.

 

[pilgrimhudd]

I remember hearing that Timothy Taylor landlord and Doom Bar (can't remember the brewery) are brewed in a different place (and thus different water) for bottling Vs cask. No idea if this is true though

I also remember hearing something similar, Sharpes got bought out by an American brewery I believe and I think I heard that Doom is brewed in the Midlands. Annoyingly I had a patient the other day that worked there, but it didn't seem like the time or place to ask.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

As a homebrewer I never bottle bitter in all its guises always keg. Why I not sure could be the carbonation or it’s part of our DNA.

 

[Clint]

I think my kegged (pb) bitter is marginally better than bottled...bulk conditioning?
I think the only time I had a bitter that had "that" taste was in York.

 

[starseeker]

I also much prefer bottle conditioned beers ,

 

[Sandimas]

Bitters are my go-to style and the beer I make the most. Really hard to get it right, no bold hop flavours to hide behind. I've brewed hundreds and am still getting there.

I find commercial bottled beers too carbonated, same for bottled homebrew although I deliberately under-carbonate when I bottle. Darker beers don't seem so bad but amber and light beers don't seem right too fizzy. I keg most of mine these days.

Fullers ESB is a good clone recipe if you want as ESB
https://recipes.brewuk.co.uk/view-recipe/66

 

[Braufather]

I’ve tried a few ESB recipes but never been happy. Just wondering what I need to do different to go for the bottled taste as opposed to cask. More carbonation for sure but what do I need to tweak to keep it in balance.

 

[foxy]

For me it is cask, bottle, with keg bringing up the rear. The Fullers ESB is a good recipe use the White Lab's British ale yeast and double the IBU if using the Tinseth scale.

 

[Braufather]

Does anyone have a recipe for an English bitter with some american hops Thrown in? I’m after something more caramelly and malty than an american pale ale But less yeast driven and more hoppy than a standard English English bitter.

i might just do an ESB malt bill with Goldings and cascade and wlp007? Thoughts?

 

[marshbrewer]

I’m after something more caramelly and malty than an american pale ale But less yeast driven and more hoppy than a standard English English bitter.

That sounds very much like an American Amber ale to me, that might help you search for a recipe that suits?

Edit - Something like this?

Make Your Best American Amber Ale

 

[Braufather]

That sounds very much like an American Amber ale to me, that might help you search for a recipe that suits?

Edit - Something like this?

Make Your Best American Amber Ale

Sort off, I’ve done my fair share of those as it’s a style I like a lot ((cwtch, 5am et) However they include some dark malts, hints of coffee and chocolate etc. and I’m after something a bit lighter with more caramel/toffee. Sort of amber like spitfire or doombar maybe.

 

[marshbrewer]

Mmm, can't say I'm an expert, having only ever had one

This one in fact; it was just as you describe - amber but americany if you see what I mean.

Red Kite

 

[trummy]

Re Doombar and TT beers. Doombar (owned by Coors) is supposed to be brewed at Rock in Cornwall although the bottled version is brewed by Marstons in BOT both barely drinkable. TT beers are still independent, originally brewed at Keighley now Knowle Springs are beers to die for. The two brewery's output cannot be compared

 

[Sadfield]

Does anyone have a recipe for an English bitter with some american hops Thrown in? I’m after something more caramelly and malty than an american pale ale But less yeast driven and more hoppy than a standard English English bitter.

i might just do an ESB malt bill with Goldings and cascade and wlp007? Thoughts?

I think you've just described a British Golden Ale

https://www.bjcp.org/style/2015/12/12A/british-golden-ale/

For the original question, the difference between commercial cask and bottled bitter tends to be higher carbonation, occasionally higher abv and filtering out yeast in the bottled versions. The bottles are then often pasturised or bottled conditioned with the bare minimum of yeast.

 

[Braufather]

I think you've just described a British Golden Ale

https://www.bjcp.org/style/2015/12/12A/british-golden-ale/

For the original question, the difference between commercial cask and bottled bitter tends to be higher carbonation, occasionally higher abv and filtering out yeast in the bottled versions. The bottles are then often pasturised or bottled conditioned with the bare minimum of yeast.

Have you right on the second point, but a bitter/ESB/ amber is quite far along the way from a golden ale. Medium Crystal malts malts are key here.

 

[Braufather]

Mmm, can't say I'm an expert, having only ever had one

This one in fact; it was just as you describe - amber but americany if you see what I mean.

Red Kite

“a smidge of Crystal and Munich malt“

sounds like an APA?

 

[marshbrewer]

sounds like an APA?

It's actually quite malty, and almost red in colour. Quite nice as I remember. Had it waiting for a plane at Inverness airport, and wanted to have another but couldn't because I was only flying to Manchester and was driving the other end. But I'd say it was much nearer a bitter in terms of maltiness and colour than an APA.