Ace micro brewer

[Chippy_Tea]

If a mod sees this, can they add note to post#108 to see post 158 for explanation?

Done :thumb:

 

[BeerCat]

You just made my day.

This explains why it cut out one time, not the other... the nightmare brew I had, with it cutting out repeatedly, the burner was black at the end and had to be scrubbed with steel wool.

If that's the problem then the brewer is working as designed, not failing for some unexplained reason.

I have been there with my ace boiler and ended up with burned beer. Its all the flour collecting on the bottom. I now boil in a separate pot and never had that problem since.

 

[appositive]

I have been there with my ace boiler and ended up with burned beer. Its all the flour collecting on the bottom. I now boil in a separate pot and never had that problem since.

I've done two brews on the klarstein mundschenk.

In the first run, I heated strike water to target temperature and then doughed in... so then had to heat water back up to target temperature after it fell ~4 degrees. I set the element to heat the mash at 2500 watts (this is the mistake, I think). Seems like the flour from dough in fell to bottom, hit the super-hot plate and burnt. It subsequently started to blow the internal breaker every few minutes; in the end could keep it running only at 1700 watts (which won't get a rolling boil). When I drained wort to fermenter, there was heavy burning at the bottom of the kettle that had to be scrubbed off with steel wool.

In the second run I heated strike water to about 5 degrees above target, doughed in and had it hit the target temperature exactly. Subsequently set the burner at 800 watts to maintain temperature during mash. Had no troubles with breaker, boiled at 2500 watts, burner was clean at end of brew.

From malhal's comment on having to scrape the GF burner to stop it from tripping breaker, I'm pretty sure my problem was the blackness on the burner, causing it to overheat.

My long-winded point being... if you've got control over the wattage of the ace boiler, you may be able to dial it in so that it doesn't burn the flour until the flour has had a chance to diffuse through the wort. Might be worth messing around with a little, given that it's probably more convenient for you to boil in the same vessel.

(Or it could be that the recirc pump is critical, that this stops the flour from settling... in which case the ace boiler, without pump, won't ever get it right).

 

[appositive]

The fact that this unit has exactly the same internal breaker setting as the grainfather suggests that the factory producing these units also produces at least the grainfather burner...

Does anyone have access to both, just to take a look and see if they are the same?

The ace unit is pretty clearly infringing on some intellectual property from the GF design (to put it mildly). But I assumed it was a copy, where someone took the GF apart and figured out how they could produce the same sort of thing in their own factory.

If it's actually the same parts, though, coming out of the same factory... as is suggested by this internal breaker thing... then the ace unit may be largely identical to the GF (with a few cosmetic changes, like form of the recirc pipe, tap, lid).

If the factory that was commissioned to produce the GF is pushing these ace units out the back door, it's not so good for GF's business plan... but it means for us that the quality of the ace / klarstein might actually be very close to that of the GF.

Not sure of this, again if someone can have a look at both that'd be great (in particular would be interesting to see if they use the same magnetic pump).

 

[BeerCat]

I've done two brews on the klarstein mundschenk.

In the first run, I heated strike water to target temperature and then doughed in... so then had to heat water back up to target temperature after it fell ~4 degrees. I set the element to heat the mash at 2500 watts (this is the mistake, I think). Seems like the flour from dough in fell to bottom, hit the super-hot plate and burnt. It subsequently started to blow the internal breaker every few minutes; in the end could keep it running only at 1700 watts (which won't get a rolling boil). When I drained wort to fermenter, there was heavy burning at the bottom of the kettle that had to be scrubbed off with steel wool.

In the second run I heated strike water to about 5 degrees above target, doughed in and had it hit the target temperature exactly. Subsequently set the burner at 800 watts to maintain temperature during mash. Had no troubles with breaker, boiled at 2500 watts, burner was clean at end of brew.

From malhal's comment on having to scrape the GF burner to stop it from tripping breaker, I'm pretty sure my problem was the blackness on the burner, causing it to overheat.

My long-winded point being... if you've got control over the wattage of the ace boiler, you may be able to dial it in so that it doesn't burn the flour until the flour has had a chance to diffuse through the wort. Might be worth messing around with a little, given that it's probably more convenient for you to boil in the same vessel.

(Or it could be that the recirc pump is critical, that this stops the flour from settling... in which case the ace boiler, without pump, won't ever get it right).

I should of said that was without a recirculating pump. Now i use one i have not had any problems and would be able to use it to boil. I had to get a paint scraper on mine so i feel your frustration. I had many boils that cut out constantly. In hindsight i should of drained it,cleaned it and started the boil again.

 

[shepp]

The fact that this unit has exactly the same internal breaker setting as the grainfather suggests that the factory producing these units also produces at least the grainfather burner...

Does anyone have access to both, just to take a look and see if they are the same?

The ace unit is pretty clearly infringing on some intellectual property from the GF design (to put it mildly). But I assumed it was a copy, where someone took the GF apart and figured out how they could produce the same sort of thing in their own factory.

If it's actually the same parts, though, coming out of the same factory... as is suggested by this internal breaker thing... then the ace unit may be largely identical to the GF (with a few cosmetic changes, like form of the recirc pipe, tap, lid).

If the factory that was commissioned to produce the GF is pushing these ace units out the back door, it's not so good for GF's business plan... but it means for us that the quality of the ace / klarstein might actually be very close to that of the GF.

Not sure of this, again if someone can have a look at both that'd be great (in particular would be interesting to see if they use the same magnetic pump).

I have to say I think your imagination is really getting the better of you :-?
You are joining up dots that don't exist
Chinese factories can reproduce items from photographs, they don't need to be produced in the same factory. There will be hundreds of factories producing water boilers and alike. I bet that if you looked into it, the thermal overload that trips on both these items is used in hundreds of different boiler related items and will be situated in exactly the same position and will trip in exactly the same circumstances. It is a standard and simple device to stop overheating.
In fact it's not even a common part in both items as one is manually reset and the other resets automatically.
It is just a boiler with a recirculating pump and a grain tube, it is hardy redesigning the internal combustion engine:wink:

 

[appositive]

I have to say I think your imagination is really getting the better of you :-?
You are joining up dots that don't exist
Chinese factories can reproduce items from photographs, they don't need to be produced in the same factory. There will be hundreds of factories producing water boilers and alike. I bet that if you looked into it, the thermal overload that trips on both these items is used in hundreds of different boiler related items and will be situated in exactly the same position and will trip in exactly the same circumstances. It is a standard and simple device to stop overheating.
In fact it's not even a common part in both items as one is manually reset and the other resets automatically.
It is just a boiler with a recirculating pump and a grain tube, it is hardy redesigning the internal combustion engine:wink:

You respond like I'm telling you that jet fuel can't melt steel beams.

These are cosmetically-very-similar, small-market-share items... wouldn't surprise me if they were produced in the same factory. Wouldn't surprise me either if this wasn't the case.

Thus the request for someone to take a look at both of them. It's interesting to me because if some or all of the guts - the pump, the post-control-box pcb, the burner - are the same, exactly the same, it will be worth knowing for long-term maintenance / repair. Which is on my mind, because until yesterday I figured mine was broken.

Do I understand you correctly that the GF requires manual reset? Again, I've got no experience with that unit... if you have one, take off some of the plastic and take a couple pictures. There is a youtube video where someone has done the same with the ace (from magic pancake, who's following this thread).

 

[dps51]

found this

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qsTg9OOYXQ[/ame]

also this
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcTXiv0XWW0[/ame]

 

[mgkpancake]

found this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qsTg9OOYXQ

also this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcTXiv0XWW0

I linked these a while back, dont forget this one I made too.

https://youtu.be/lvvNzy3X1rs

Here's Mr. Cherrystone brewing on one. Loved the strainer bag idea into fermentation vessel

https://youtu.be/kWldKJG4YhA

 

[Fil]

fwiw the grainfather kettle has got a manual reset on its thermal switch, and whiole it does not need any dismantling to operate, it is opperated via a long pushrod from the base centre, SO unless you have the kettle wedged on a couple of rails so you can slip your hand under the base It can involve an uncomfortable kettle hug as you draw it over the 'shelf' edge till the central base reset button becomes accessable!!

If it will also reset without intervention i cant say i have never had 10-15 minutes of patience on the odd brewday it has occoured.. (Once with a brew and only then as i had the reflashed stc1000+ OVBS pid controller set with a too high a n element frequency value)

The grainfather kettle is Very similar to the Still Spirits T500 kettle (minus tap) fwiw

As to the factories they hail from Im not gonna comment on that :)

 

[shepp]

The unit looks very similar, I bet the still is interchangeable
The location is in New Zealand and the website layout is very similar to the Grainfathers. It could well be the same company.
They are probably made in the same factory as it appears to be a far less tenuous link.

 

[dps51]

just wondering what is the life span on the heater element
can you fit a new one or is the whole thing just scrap metal

 

[Fil]

yes its the same folk behind the 2 companies @shep, and yes the t500 lid fits the g/f and the grainfather optional still head will also fit the t500 kettle and is also sold for the t500 as a pot still alternative.

 

[Fil]

The unit looks very similar, I bet the still is interchangeable
The location is in New Zealand and the website layout is very similar to the Grainfathers. It could well be the same company.
They are probably made in the same factory as it appears to be a far less tenuous link.

it is the same folk in this case, and the optional G/G copper pot still head is also sold as a pot still alternative for the t500..

 

[malhal]

Old version of Bulldog brewery is currently £335 includes a chiller (immersion not counterflow though). The pump is external which means it can be used for other purposes.

Disclaimer, never used the Bulldog or ordered from thebrewshop.com

Personally I think the Ace should be priced at £200 given it only has a couple of extra features over a converted Buffalo water boiler. That being automated stirring and digital temp control.

 

[Personal91]

Doing my first rolling boil test (with only about 10-15) litres in it , is it okay to have the glass cover on it while boiling or not?

+ can I use the pump when it's boiling ?

Was thinking to do so to sterilise the unit and all components

 

[grmski]

You're not supposed to use the pump during the boil and the lid should be off.

 

[Personal91]

You're not supposed to use the pump during the boil and the lid should be off.

I thought as much, so went with my better judgement and didn't

Just wanted to see if the unit was working

Now to either get a wort chiller or make 1

 

[appositive]

I've had one of these units (klarstein branded, but identical to the ace) since mid-january. Have brewed about 8 times on it. On brew yesterday, though, I seem to have lost half the burner element.

Had just ramped up to boil after mash and sparge... was going fine, then kitchen power breaker blew. After resetting breaker, brewer unit started up as normal... but was very slow to heat. Eventually brought wort to a boil, but not the rolling boil this thing has produced in the past.

This morning I filled with water and turned on (2500) watts; watching it, I could see bubbles accumulate on only half the burner (in a C shape). So I'm assuming that the burner is composed of two (or more) units, and that I've lost one of them.

Could be a connection thing, so will take it apart to see how wiring looks when I get a chance. I expect, though, that I'm up against a bigger problem.

Any advice appreciated (in particular, anyone know where to find a replacement burner?).

 

[Ale]

I've had one of these units (klarstein branded, but identical to the ace) since mid-january. Have brewed about 8 times on it. On brew yesterday, though, I seem to have lost half the burner element.

Had just ramped up to boil after mash and sparge... was going fine, then kitchen power breaker blew. After resetting breaker, brewer unit started up as normal... but was very slow to heat. Eventually brought wort to a boil, but not the rolling boil this thing has produced in the past.

This morning I filled with water and turned on (2500) watts; watching it, I could see bubbles accumulate on only half the burner (in a C shape). So I'm assuming that the burner is composed of two (or more) units, and that I've lost one of them.

Could be a connection thing, so will take it apart to see how wiring looks when I get a chance. I expect, though, that I'm up against a bigger problem.

Any advice appreciated (in particular, anyone know where to find a replacement burner?).

I wouldnt recommend taking anything apart until you have checked to see if there is a warranty that came with it. Taking things apart generally voids the warranty.