Another brewzilla question.

Sozzled Sab · Nov 22, 2024

Hi everyone
I am looking for advice on doughing in on my brewzilla 3.1.1. My normal process is to heat the water to strike temperature with the malt pipe in place then turn off the 1900w element,lower the temperature to 66c and add the grain.so my questions are.
Should I leave the malt pipe out until strike temperature is reached?
Should I begin recirculation as soon as I
start adding the grain. After my research on various threads and you tube I cannot seem to find a definitive answer.
Any advice would be appreciated.

Rwilts · Nov 22, 2024

Well it wont be the definative answer - But what i do is -
Set the initial temperature to a few degrees above the desired mash temp, as adding the malt pipe and the grain will loose me a few degrees - Normally i just set to 70 as this gives me enough 'headroom' for any mash temp but you can actually work it out exactly.
I actually fill the brewzilla to 30 litres and then remove the excess liquid for sparging later.

I use both elements to get up to 70 . then reset the target temp to the desired mash temperature, still have both elements on.

Leave the malt pipe out until I am adding the grain.

Put pipe in and add grain etc.. the temp will drop and when it gets to (66 in your example) elements will kick in to maintain.

I always leave the mash 10 minutes before starting the circulation to ensure that the grain bed is settled. (yu can either count this towards your mash time or not dont think it makes much of a difference)

The only time i have needed to recirculate whilst mashing in was when i had a large grain bill but for an average 5kg grain bill its not necessary. Consider adding rice hulls if you have them - I add them every time irispective of grain make up.

The Baron · Nov 22, 2024

Very similar to Rwilts
I bring to 2 degrees above mash temp to allow for grain temp drop(i put my grain in a warm room to minimise temp drop) then mash in let it settle for 10 mins and drop the to mash temp and then drop machine heater down to about 45/50% for the mash with re-circ.
Ps I always heat the water with the malt pipe in for 2 reasons further temp drop if it is cols and 2 forgetting to put it in before adding the grain-been there done that aheadbutt

Rwilts · Nov 22, 2024

Having also left the malt pipe out once ! its a good option - for me , i prefer to see the volume of water in the boiler and , although completely unjustified, don't want the malt pipe to remove the water capacity -- I just remember the horror when i realised what I did and make sure it goes in :)

The Baron · Nov 22, 2024

Too many senior moments for me nowadays so always put it in :laugh8:

foxy · Nov 22, 2024

Sozzled Sab said:
Hi everyone
I am looking for advice on doughing in on my brewzilla 3.1.1. My normal process is to heat the water to strike temperature with the malt pipe in place then turn off the 1900w element,lower the temperature to 66c and add the grain.so my questions are.
Should I leave the malt pipe out until strike temperature is reached?
Should I begin recirculation as soon as I
start adding the grain. After my research on various threads and you tube I cannot seem to find a definitive answer.
Any advice would be appreciated.

Have a look what Kai says on Braukaiser. Brew house efficiency. Dough in below your saccharification rest temperature to preserve the beta amylase enzymes which degrade quickly.
Keep your malt pipe in while heating as that is another source of heat exchange.
If I am mashing at 67C I dough in at 66C and I am recirculating at the same time.
Doesn’t matter if the temperature drops a couple of degrees, when the temperature hits target start the mash.

MashBag · Nov 22, 2024

^ that

The Baron · Nov 22, 2024

This is how I always did it Foxy until I got he Brewzilla Gen4 and the opinion seems to be to let the mash settle before circulation for 10 minutes so that is what I have been doing.
What is your opinion on this for the Gen4

foxy · Nov 22, 2024

The Baron said:
This is how I always did it Foxy until I got he Brewzilla Gen4 and the opinion seems to be to let the mash settle before circulation for 10 minutes so that is what I have been doing.
What is your opinion on this for the Gen4

When doughing in, as with the mash I would be looking for an even temperature throughout. There is what is known as thermal stratification in water where water separates into different temperatures and densities. The beta-amylase denatures quickly as temperatures rise. So for any vessel, I would prefer an even temperature which circulation helps to achieve.
Ashton Lewis ( Mr Wizard )who is a master brewer and has been a brewer for over 30 years says he always doughs in at 32C and then raises the temperature to his saccharification temperature.

The Baron · Nov 23, 2024

I guess he is re-circing all the time while doughing in and raising the temp?
I may give that a go

Sozzled Sab · Nov 23, 2024

Thanks everyone for the helpful and informative replies,certainly gives me something to think about.
I think I can feel some experimtation coming over the next few brews.

Twostage · Nov 24, 2024

foxy said:
When doughing in, as with the mash I would be looking for an even temperature throughout. There is what is known as thermal stratification in water where water separates into different temperatures and densities. The beta-amylase denatures quickly as temperatures rise. So for any vessel, I would prefer an even temperature which circulation helps to achieve.
Ashton Lewis ( Mr Wizard )who is a master brewer and has been a brewer for over 30 years says he always doughs in at 32C and then raises the temperature to his saccharification temperature.

Interesting

Twostage · Nov 24, 2024

There’s also underletting (I think) where you keep the malt pipe out and put all the malt in it and then put the pipe and malt in as one. Not sure what the advantage of this technique would be :confused.:

.

foxy · Nov 24, 2024

Twostage said:
There’s also underletting (I think) where you keep the malt pipe out and put all the malt in it and then put the pipe and malt in as one. Not sure what the advantage of this technique would be .

There is also writing in the right temperature, Ashton Lewis doughed in at 62C not 32C

Larse · Nov 24, 2024

foxy said:
There is also writing in the right temperature, Ashton Lewis doughed in at 62C not 32C

Lol. That one had me scratching my head.

The Baron · Nov 24, 2024

Well Foxy I have just doughed in at 32c :laugh8:

so we will see if it has any effect on the beer.
It is a style I brew on a regular basis so I should find out if its thinner has better eff etc.
Two things I can say up to know is after a few stirs I was able to keep the pump on FULL all the way through the temp raise and mash.
It did take longer to get to my mashing temp than I expected though, just waiting for my sample to cool down so we will see where the eff is

sifty · Nov 24, 2024

Why leave the malt pipe out? Am I missing something?

I add water to the level required, insert pipe, bottom screen and overflow tube (with rubber cap) add salts and set temp with pump running so things circulate while everything heats up. I measure temp with a calibrated in-line gauge at top of pump tube and have found I need to have the BZ setpoint a degree or 2 higher to meet the target temp.

Usually weigh and mill grain while heating. When at temp I dough in, and stir till I get good flow (which is when I start mash time) then add top screen and overflow cone. Usually give it an additional stir a couple of times during the mash (although the Doppelbock with 9kg of grain needed constant stirring).

Seems simple and I always meet or exceed targets...

Rodcx500z · Nov 24, 2024

I never leave the malt pipe out, i did it once what a mess :laugh8:

The Baron · Nov 24, 2024

Well up to now the 32c grain addition has produced my usual 75% Eff so all is well just need to wait to see where it finishes and if it has affected the mouthfeel

sifty · Nov 24, 2024

Pic during heatup showing in-line temp gauge. It's one of the most useful mods I have made. I have checked actual mash temp with long probe thermometer and is always pretty close...

Another brewzilla question.

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